I didn’t think one could find a copy of the message online. I will listen to the message.

Thanks for posting this.

Here’s the link for the conference. Better to listen and read with context…not just on this topic but also the broader subject of godly manhood.

http://www.crosswaync.org/summit2006/index.html

In Christ,
James Tuttle

One thing I think that Josh Harris didn’t take into account with his book and how others apply it is that Josh Harris before he actually “kissed”dating goodbye he had done some dating and thus developed some relationship skills with those of the opposite sex. Also, listening to a few messages from Josh Harris, indicate that he was never on the shy side with women and didn’t need much work on learning how to interact with the opposite sex.

The problem is that a lot of people aren’t like Josh Harris. They haven’t had much interaction and need to develop over time certain relational skills. Sadly “kissing dating goodbye” stops this development from happening with a lot of singles and they also didn’t have the chance that Josh Harris had before his big decision.

Steve

I think our youth need to avoid exclusive, committed relationships until they’ve had time to learn about how to interact with the opposite sex in a Biblical and effective manner. That, I think, would be best able to happen in church events that foster supervised, group dating scenarios designed to prepare them for flying solo when they are mature enough.

This is just an idea, and I am not saying it’s a Bible mandate, btw. I agree: people shouldn’t preach their theories on dating as Bible-mandated.

I think the principal of reaping/sowing applies as much to datinbg as it does “faith healing” and every other area of our lives. We recently posted an entry on our blog along those lines called “God really does help those who help themselves” (see http://appliedtruthandinterest.blogspot.com/2009/10/god-really-does-help-those-who-help.html).

The point I am trying to impress on others is this: whether it is dating or any other facet of life from your finances to your job to your friendships, you won’t get something for nothing. God requires an investment of prayer, faith, obedience, and effort of us when answering our prayers. He does answer prayers and perform miracles, but God requires us to do our part here on Earth. That’s how he made the universe to work. God doesn’t need our efforts, but he does require them. Just examine the lives of the apostles for confirmation.

I highly recommend people carefully sow in this way in the area of dating if they want to reap the harvest of a happy marriage. To do nothing and expect everything from the Lord is to mick Him, and God does not respond to or tolerate mockery.

But that could just be me

Thanks for posting another comment. I think we are in agreement that “kissing dating goodbye” is more appropriate for teenagers vs. older singles.

IMO, some of the things that “kissing dating goodbye” teaches younger singles almost need to be unlearned when one becomes more mature is ready for a mate. The other problem is that “kissing dating goodbye” many times leads to people learning to AVOID relating with those of the opposite sex vs. LEARNING how to relate.

An example of needing to unlearn things is someone’s interest in that of the opposite sex. “Kissing dating goodbye” says to avoid any romantic attachments since you aren’t ready for marriage. If one keeps that mentality then they are most likely to be “kissing marriage” goodbye.

Thanks again for your comment.

Kissing dating goodbye may have some value for young teenagers, but for adults, I have never personally seen it work. Most all the happily married Christian couples I know dated before getting married, and not just their spouse.

For me, the courtship approach involves too much waiting and not enough sowing. One of the most universally true principals of the Bible can be found in Galatians 6:7, which reminds us that “God will not be mocked.” this is because we reap what we sow. If you plant a sunflower seed, you can bet that you will not reap anything other than a sunflower. Similarly, if we sow nothing, then we reap nothing.

I wrote an article called “No Deposit; No return” at the ATI blog (http://appliedtruthandinterest.blogspot.com/2009/09/no-deposit-no-return.html) that expads on this reasoning, but I believe it to be especially true in dating. If you are waiting for a spouse to fall into your lap, then you have missed God’s design for our lives entirely. Absent some revelation from the Lord commanding you to wait for Him to deliver a spouse to you, if you sow waiting, then waiting is what you will reap. Lots of waiting. Anything else mocks the Lord’s design.

Thanks for sharing these links. I will take a look at them.

Steve